Return-Path: Received: from g4 dot comkal dot net (g4 dot comkal dot net [192.168.1.22]) by mail. (Weasel v1.20) for ; 25 May 2001 01:00:00 From: "Digest" To: "OS/2GenAu Digest" Date: Fri, 25 May 2001 01:00:00 +1000 (EDT) Reply-To: "OS2GenAu" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: CASMailer 1.0 for OS/2 Warp PPC 1.05/G4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: No. 68 Message-ID: <200105250100.000029G6atmail.> Date:- 25 May 2001 1================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 00:03:27 +1000 From: David Halprin Subject: [os2genau] S3 Trio Display Adapter Drivers Hi Guys Does anyone in the readership know the URL for S3 Trio Display Adapter Drivers (for any platform) I run Win-98 and OS/2 and would like an update. http:\\www.mrdriver dot com has not updated its link since S3 was merged with some new parent company. Also I tried http://www.driver dot com but that is a `different kettle of fish'. It seems to be a disparate collection of submitted drivers without guaranteed authenticity. Ian at the meeting last night remembered Diamond may have been one of the parties in the merger but thinks that there is yet another now. I tried Google and other search engines to no avail. Many thanks for reading this David Halprin 2================================================ From: "Chris Graham [WarpSpeed]" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 00:30:50 +1000 (EST) Subject: [os2genau] UML Anyone? Is anyone using UML for their web design? If anyone is interested, I've managed to get TogetherJ 4.1 and 4.2 working under OS/2 using Java 1.3. I can supply the .CMD file and .ICO file to all interested. -Chris WarpSpeed Computers - The Graham Utilities for OS/2. Voice: +61-3-9307-0611 PO Box 212 FidoNet: 3:632/344 FAX: +61-3-9307-0633 Brunswick Internet: chrisgatwarpspeed dot com dot au BBS: +61-3-9307-0644 VIC 3056 CompuServe: 100250,1645 300-28,800 N,8,1 ANSI Australia Web Page: http://www.warpspeed dot com dot au 3================================================ From: "Ian Manners" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 01:42:43 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: [os2genau] S3 Trio Display Adapter Drivers Hi David The OS/2 drivers from S3 havent been updated for many years, unless they are for the S3 chipset used in various IBM PC's and servers. Have a look at http://www.os2site dot com/sw/drivers/video/ there are about 26 S3 drivers there, apart from that, the SDD drivers work fine, though if you want the max resolution, you will need to purchase the drivers. I'm using the s3.zip drivers from 1996, in 1600x1200 and 65536 colours and at 85Hz with no problems at all on my Netfinity, I'm also using the SDD drivers on other servers with S3 chipsets with no problems as well. The IBM OEMed one is sddse704.exe in the same directory (SDD Special Edition v7.04). You can get the latest one (7.05) if you have SWC. Cheers Ian B Manners 4================================================ From: "Ian Manners" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 01:43:58 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: [os2genau] UML Anyone? Hi Chris >Is anyone using UML for their web design? ok, whats UML ? >If anyone is interested, I've managed to get TogetherJ 4.1 and 4.2 working >under OS/2 using Java 1.3. I can supply the .CMD file and .ICO file to all >interested. Where do I get TogetherJ from, then I'll have a look at it :-) Cheers Ian B Manners 5================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 04:21:39 +1000 From: Daryl Pilkington Subject: Re: [os2genau] Swap size Hi Graham, FUNCTION: PARTITION: DRIVE LETTER: Operating system Primary C: Applications Maintenance Logical D: Swapper Spooler Data Logical E: More data Logical F: etc CD-ROM - S: ******************************************************************* RULE 1: Never put the swapper or spooler on your data or OS drive. ******************************************************************* Applications have the potential to create huge print jobs or consume all available memory. If either of these conditions occur, they have the potential to completely fill the partition they are on. A full partition has the potential to completely destroy all the data on it:- Maybe not directly, but could cause the computer to trap, causing CHKDSK to run at restart, destroying files. I have seen the above happen, usually by people who have been told & think they know better :) The above rule works on all operating systems. As Ian mentioned, having the swapper between the OS partition & your data partition means the HDD heads are centrally located. ******************************************************************* RULE 2: Assign the CD-ROM a high driver letter. ******************************************************************* In config.sys add: reservedriveletter=r Additional partitions/HDD won't bugger up the CD-ROM drive letter assignment. Ian Manners wrote: > > Hi Graham > > >Given that most of us have only 1 hard drive... > >my usual practice > >130 Meg RAM > >12G hD > >so > > >Operating system Primary partition: drive c > >Maintenance Logical partition drive d > >applications and data Logical partition drive e > >Swap file Logical partition drive f (swapper.dat file 120meg) > > I would put the swap file on a partition between c & e, though > on modern HD's, I think I'd leave it were it is, modern seek times > are very impressive. > > >at work I am running concurrently... > > >Voice Type Dication > >Speech Advantage Medical for OS2 > > Now this I'm interested in, is it still available ? > I dont think I've met one Neurologist that doesnt use either > speech software, or an Apple Newton with everthing plugged > into it, Neurologist's seem to always be able to do the things > with technology that were ment to be done. > > >comments on set up and swap file? Should the swap file be on my E Drive? > > Swap file would be better on E, even better between your system disk, > and your apps disk. ie, D drive, that way if you are using the swapper > file, the HD heads are centrally positioned between your C and E > drives. > > Cheers > Ian B Manners > -- Regards, Daryl Pilkington //// The PC-Therapist, Business Computing Integration O OS/2 Warp, Redhat Linux, DB2 IBM Certified Systems Expert email: darylpatpc-therapist dot com dot au ICQ: 91914134 Tel: +61-2-8902-1300 Mob: +61-425-251-300 Fax: +61-2-9411-3720 Mob SMS: 0425251300.0000atorangenet dot com dot au (120 characters max, send no carriage returns) 6================================================ From: "Dr Graham Norton FRACP Neurologist" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 09:29:07 +1100 (EDT) Subject: Re: [os2genau] Swap size Hi Ian I believe that I would be one of the few remaining uses of this sophisticated and excellent combination of voice related software in the world, let alone Australia! I am sure that you will realize that voice recognition began with a tumultuous welcome but has almost died a slow and unnoticed death at least in terms of spontaneous dictation. I have attempted to introduce this technology to several of my medical colleagues who have persisted for variable lengths of time but all have eventually stopped. There is a tremendous misconception amongst computer uses about several issues Firstly they assume that "continuous speech" is synonomous with "conversational speech" and this is not correct. Secondly they assume that the more powerful the processor and the more random accessed memory they have, then the faster and more accurate will be the voice recognition. Sadly this is not correct and the most important factor in accuracy is indeed clarity of speech, memory and processor speed being important but less so. Being a particularly obsessive and compulsive person, a definite advantage to a neurologist, I have persisted and my present setup is certainly excellent and performs well for me with a dictation rate of about 70 - 80 words per minute with an accuracy rate of almost 90 - 95%. Moreover I have modified the system and now email most of my letters again by using voice navigation and this is useful with about 30% of my letters and reports, the rest are usually sent by facsimile. Email users are increasing in the medical fraternity. Occasionally I communicate with the developer of the software Speech Medical Advantage but sadly he dropped out of development when IBM apparently stopped development of voice recognition for os2 and have continued development for both windows and Linux. I still use the original VoiceType dictation within OS2 but it has developed significantly with more than five years of use. I probably would dictate on average 2000 letters and requests and reports each year. On Wed, 23 May 2001 21:47:43 +1000 (EST), Ian Manners wrote: >Hi Graham > >>Given that most of us have only 1 hard drive... >>my usual practice >>130 Meg RAM >>12G hD >>so > >>Operating system Primary partition: drive c >>Maintenance Logical partition drive d >>applications and data Logical partition drive e >>Swap file Logical partition drive f (swapper.dat file 120meg) > >I would put the swap file on a partition between c & e, though >on modern HD's, I think I'd leave it were it is, modern seek times >are very impressive. > >>at work I am running concurrently... > >>Voice Type Dication >>Speech Advantage Medical for OS2 > >Now this I'm interested in, is it still available ? >I dont think I've met one Neurologist that doesnt use either >speech software, or an Apple Newton with everthing plugged >into it, Neurologist's seem to always be able to do the things >with technology that were ment to be done. > >>comments on set up and swap file? Should the swap file be on my E Drive? > >Swap file would be better on E, even better between your system disk, >and your apps disk. ie, D drive, that way if you are using the swapper >file, the HD heads are centrally positioned between your C and E >drives. > >Cheers >Ian B Manners This e mail has been processed and sent using IBM Voice Type Dicatation for OS/2 Speech Advantage Medical for OS/2 PMMail V2 for OS/2 (To minimise internet /virus infection, I have a policy of not using Microsoft products) The contents of this email are confidental and may be protected by professional privilege. If you are not the named recipient please destroy immediately and notify the sender. Do not copy or distribute without authorisation. This document is not to be used for medico-legal purposes without the express permission of the author. 7================================================ From: "Dr Graham Norton FRACP Neurologist" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 13:28:12 +1100 (EDT) Subject: Re: [os2genau] Swap size How does one place the spooler on a non OS drive as it defaults to C:\SPOOL surely?? why have the applications on the C Drive? On Thu, 24 May 2001 04:21:39 +1000, Daryl Pilkington wrote: >Hi Graham, > >FUNCTION: PARTITION: DRIVE LETTER: >Operating system Primary C: >Applications > >Maintenance Logical D: >Swapper >Spooler > >Data Logical E: > >More data Logical F: etc > >CD-ROM - S: > >******************************************************************* >RULE 1: >Never put the swapper or spooler on your data or OS drive. >******************************************************************* > >Applications have the potential to create huge print jobs or consume all >available memory. >If either of these conditions occur, they have the potential to >completely fill the partition they are on. > >A full partition has the potential to completely destroy all the data on >it:- >Maybe not directly, but could cause the computer to trap, causing CHKDSK >to run at restart, destroying files. > >I have seen the above happen, usually by people who have been told & >think they know better :) >The above rule works on all operating systems. > >As Ian mentioned, having the swapper between the OS partition & your >data partition means the HDD heads are centrally located. > >******************************************************************* >RULE 2: >Assign the CD-ROM a high driver letter. >******************************************************************* > >In config.sys add: >reservedriveletter=r > >Additional partitions/HDD won't bugger up the CD-ROM drive letter >assignment. > >Ian Manners wrote: >> >> Hi Graham >> >> >Given that most of us have only 1 hard drive... >> >my usual practice >> >130 Meg RAM >> >12G hD >> >so >> >> >Operating system Primary partition: drive c >> >Maintenance Logical partition drive d >> >applications and data Logical partition drive e >> >Swap file Logical partition drive f (swapper.dat file 120meg) >> >> I would put the swap file on a partition between c & e, though >> on modern HD's, I think I'd leave it were it is, modern seek times >> are very impressive. >> >> >at work I am running concurrently... >> >> >Voice Type Dication >> >Speech Advantage Medical for OS2 >> >> Now this I'm interested in, is it still available ? >> I dont think I've met one Neurologist that doesnt use either >> speech software, or an Apple Newton with everthing plugged >> into it, Neurologist's seem to always be able to do the things >> with technology that were ment to be done. >> >> >comments on set up and swap file? Should the swap file be on my E Drive? >> >> Swap file would be better on E, even better between your system disk, >> and your apps disk. ie, D drive, that way if you are using the swapper >> file, the HD heads are centrally positioned between your C and E >> drives. >> >> Cheers >> Ian B Manners >> >-- >Regards, > >Daryl Pilkington > >//// The PC-Therapist, Business Computing Integration >O\_/ > OS/2 Warp, Redhat Linux, DB2 > IBM Certified Systems Expert > > email: darylpatpc-therapist dot com dot au > ICQ: 91914134 > Tel: +61-2-8902-1300 > Mob: +61-425-251-300 > Fax: +61-2-9411-3720 > Mob SMS: 0425251300.0000atorangenet dot com dot au > (120 characters max, send no carriage returns) Graham Norton President OS2 Users Group SA 8================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 16:53:23 +1000 From: Daryl Pilkington Subject: Re: [os2genau] Swap size Hi Graham, Uh, you caught me out on these questions, forgot to answer them, was hoping you wouldn't think of these & require answers :) Go to the spooler object in the WPS Properties 1st pane selects where the print spooler directory sits. "... It is recommended that when you set up your hard disk, you create a minimum of 3 partitions. One will be for the operating system(s), one for your applications and static data files, and another for dynamic data files and temporary files ...." See Reference 1. Most OS/2 applications either make changes to config.sys or os2.ini, so once they are installed they are bolted into the operating system. If the applications are on a different partition to the OS, restoring only the OS partition without the application partition would either render the installation un-operable or at least cause errors at boot time. So separating them onto their own partition serves no useful purpose. I have been using the C: D: E: configuration for years & I've never found the arrangement lacking, so I suppose its A Good Thing, even though IBM have a *slightly* different opinion. Reference 1: OS/2 Warp 4 Capacity Planning and Performance Tuning Guide W4-PAPER.LWP Document Number: WARP4TTT December 5, 1996 Personal Software Products Duc J. Vianney, Ph. D., Senior Programmer OS/2 External Performance, Austin, TX Tony White, OS/2 Performance Consultant Personal Systems Solutions Center, Dallas, TX Trust this helps. Dr Graham Norton FRACP Neurologist wrote: > > How does one place the spooler on a non OS drive as it defaults to C:\SPOOL > surely?? > > why have the applications on the C Drive? > > On Thu, 24 May 2001 04:21:39 +1000, Daryl Pilkington wrote: > > >Hi Graham, > > > >FUNCTION: PARTITION: DRIVE LETTER: > >Operating system Primary C: > >Applications > > > >Maintenance Logical D: > >Swapper > >Spooler > > > >Data Logical E: > > > >More data Logical F: etc > > > >CD-ROM - S: > > > >******************************************************************* > >RULE 1: > >Never put the swapper or spooler on your data or OS drive. > >******************************************************************* > > > >Applications have the potential to create huge print jobs or consume all > >available memory. > >If either of these conditions occur, they have the potential to > >completely fill the partition they are on. > > > >A full partition has the potential to completely destroy all the data on > >it:- > >Maybe not directly, but could cause the computer to trap, causing CHKDSK > >to run at restart, destroying files. > > > >I have seen the above happen, usually by people who have been told & > >think they know better :) > >The above rule works on all operating systems. > > > >As Ian mentioned, having the swapper between the OS partition & your > >data partition means the HDD heads are centrally located. > > > >******************************************************************* > >RULE 2: > >Assign the CD-ROM a high driver letter. > >******************************************************************* > > > >In config.sys add: > >reservedriveletter=r > > > >Additional partitions/HDD won't bugger up the CD-ROM drive letter > >assignment. > > SNIP > -- Regards, Daryl Pilkington //// The PC-Therapist, Business Computing Integration O OS/2 Warp, Redhat Linux, DB2 IBM Certified Systems Expert email: darylpatpc-therapist dot com dot au ICQ: 91914134 Tel: +61-2-8902-1300 Mob: +61-425-251-300 Fax: +61-2-9411-3720 Mob SMS: 0425251300.0000atorangenet dot com dot au (120 characters max, send no carriage returns) 9================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 18:27:34 +1000 From: Daryl Pilkington Subject: [os2genau] Dual-Boot eCS & Win98 or W2k Hi, I want to make a dual-boot eCS & Win98 box. This is slightly OT, but you'll see where the Linux fits in later. I want to use my regular partition arrangement: eCS: c: OS, applications d: temp, swapper, spooler maintenance e: data Win: c: OS, applications d: temp, swapper, spooler e: data ie I want both operating systems to see the same drives so there is no confusion for the user. Currently I do the following. PARTITION TYPE FUNCTION FILESYSTEM 1 Primary Win98 c: FAT32 2 Primary eCS c: HPFS 3 Logical eCS d: HPFS 4 Logical eCS e: HPFS 5 Logical Win98 d: FAT32 6 Logical Win98 e: FAT32 Booting eCS users see: 2 Primary c: HPFS 3 Logical d: HPFS 4 Logical e: HPFS 5 Logical f: FAT32 6 Logical g: FAT32 ie c: d: e: HPFS & users just ignore f: g: Booting Win98 users see: 1 Primary c: FAT32 5 Logical d: FAT32 6 Logical e: FAT32 ie c: d: e: FAT32 which is what the users are used to. Now I want to use a shared data drive e: but not FAT32 because its crap. PARTITION TYPE FUNCTION FILESYSTEM 1 Primary Win95 c: FAT32 2 Primary OS/2 c: HPFS 3 Logical temp d: ???? 4 Logical data e: ???? I'm thinking a Linux ext2fs file system would be A Good Thing. Is there a read-write installable file-system for Windoze & eCS? What limitations are there? -- Regards, Daryl Pilkington //// The PC-Therapist, Business Computing Integration O OS/2 Warp, Redhat Linux, DB2 IBM Certified Systems Expert email: darylpatpc-therapist dot com dot au ICQ: 91914134 Tel: +61-2-8902-1300 Mob: +61-425-251-300 Fax: +61-2-9411-3720 Mob SMS: 0425251300.0000atorangenet dot com dot au (120 characters max, send no carriage returns) 10================================================ From: "Steve Edmonds" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 22:04:18 +1100 (EDT) Subject: Re: [os2genau] Swap size I have my applications on a separate drive, even a network drive. I have reinstalled the os 2x without problems. The majority of my applications only need a new program object. For me there has been a huge advantage in partitioning. C: Dos, I can always boot to a running dos. D: Tempory storage, shared between os2/win/linux e:OS/2 system F:os2 spooler, swap, data G:os2 applications, second minimal warg install(maintainence install). For disc upgrades install a new drive, format, and xcopy f:, g:, boot to maintainence, xcopy real os to new partitions, remove old drive. steve On Thu, 24 May 2001 16:53:23 +1000, Daryl Pilkington wrote: >Most OS/2 applications either make changes to config.sys or os2.ini, so >once they are installed they are bolted into the operating system. > >If the applications are on a different partition to the OS, restoring >only the OS partition without the application partition would either >render the installation un-operable or at least cause errors at boot >time. > >So separating them onto their own partition serves no useful purpose. _______________ Steve Edmonds Steve71atattglobal dot net 11================================================ From: "John Angelico" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 19:10:41 +0900 (EST) Subject: Re: [os2genau] Swap size On Thu, 24 May 2001 13:28:12 +1100 (EDT), Dr Graham Norton FRACP Neurologist wrote: Hello, Dr Graham >How does one place the spooler on a non OS drive as it defaults to C:\SPOOL >surely?? Err, change the default :). If you go to the Spooler Object you will see the path (as you say, default is c:\spool). Go to the Spool Path page and check the help, which gives a clear explanation. >why have the applications on the C Drive? Well, the spooler is not really an application - it's more a system object closely tied to the OS, so I can understand the logic of system functions defaulting to the boot drive. Also, using minimum assumptions, a system with only one drive requires defaults to C: (or generically ) and in this case making a change is trivial and low-risk so I guess IBM has never bothered to change the default. Best regards John Angelico OS/2 SIG talldadatmelbpc dot org dot au or talldadatkepl dot com dot au -------------------------------------------- PMTagline v1.50 - Copyright, 1996-1997, Stephen Berg and John Angelico .... WHO said Windows was a Power Tool??? 12================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 19:46:17 +1000 From: Ed Durrant Subject: Re: [os2genau] Dual-Boot eCS & Win98 or W2k Does it have to be Win98, not WinNT4/2000 ?? If you could use the 32 bit Windoze rather than the 16 bit DOS windoze, you could use HPFS across the board. Ed. Daryl Pilkington wrote: > > Hi, > I want to make a dual-boot eCS & Win98 box. > This is slightly OT, but you'll see where the Linux fits in later. > > I want to use my regular partition arrangement: > eCS: > c: OS, applications > d: temp, swapper, spooler maintenance > e: data > > Win: > c: OS, applications > d: temp, swapper, spooler > e: data > > ie I want both operating systems to see the same drives so there is no > confusion for the user. > > Currently I do the following. > > PARTITION TYPE FUNCTION FILESYSTEM > 1 Primary Win98 c: FAT32 > 2 Primary eCS c: HPFS > 3 Logical eCS d: HPFS > 4 Logical eCS e: HPFS > 5 Logical Win98 d: FAT32 > 6 Logical Win98 e: FAT32 > > Booting eCS users see: > 2 Primary c: HPFS > 3 Logical d: HPFS > 4 Logical e: HPFS > 5 Logical f: FAT32 > 6 Logical g: FAT32 > > ie c: d: e: HPFS & users just ignore f: g: > > Booting Win98 users see: > 1 Primary c: FAT32 > 5 Logical d: FAT32 > 6 Logical e: FAT32 > > ie c: d: e: FAT32 which is what the users are used to. > > Now I want to use a shared data drive e: but not FAT32 because its crap. > > PARTITION TYPE FUNCTION FILESYSTEM > 1 Primary Win95 c: FAT32 > 2 Primary OS/2 c: HPFS > 3 Logical temp d: ???? > 4 Logical data e: ???? > > I'm thinking a Linux ext2fs file system would be A Good Thing. > Is there a read-write installable file-system for Windoze & eCS? > What limitations are there? > > -- > Regards, > > Daryl Pilkington > > //// The PC-Therapist, Business Computing Integration > O \_/ > OS/2 Warp, Redhat Linux, DB2 > IBM Certified Systems Expert > > email: darylpatpc-therapist dot com dot au > ICQ: 91914134 > Tel: +61-2-8902-1300 > Mob: +61-425-251-300 > Fax: +61-2-9411-3720 > Mob SMS: 0425251300.0000atorangenet dot com dot au > (120 characters max, send no carriage returns) 13================================================ From: "David Forrester" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 20:30:03 +1100 (EDT) Subject: Re: [os2genau] Dual-Boot eCS & Win98 or W2k On Thu, 24 May 2001 19:46:17 +1000, Ed Durrant wrote: >Does it have to be Win98, not WinNT4/2000 ?? If you could use >the 32 bit Windoze rather than the 16 bit DOS windoze, you could >use HPFS across the board. I knew that NT4 had HPFS support (or could be convinced to see it), but, I didn't think that Win2000 could. How do we do it? -- David Forrester davidforatterrigal dot net dot au http://www.os2world dot com/djfos2/ 14================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 20:43:12 +1000 From: Ed Durrant Subject: Re: [os2genau] Dual-Boot eCS & Win98 or W2k I believe I read that the same procedure of installing Pinball.dll and modifying the registry works under the NT4 based W2K as it does in NT4 but I haven't actually tried it myself, not feeling the urge to (IMO) waste money on Windows 2000. Ed. David Forrester wrote: > > On Thu, 24 May 2001 19:46:17 +1000, Ed Durrant wrote: > > >Does it have to be Win98, not WinNT4/2000 ?? If you could use > >the 32 bit Windoze rather than the 16 bit DOS windoze, you could > >use HPFS across the board. > > I knew that NT4 had HPFS support (or could be convinced to see it), > but, I didn't think that Win2000 could. How do we do it? > > -- > David Forrester > davidforatterrigal dot net dot au > http://www.os2world dot com/djfos2/ 15================================================ From: "David Forrester" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 21:47:15 +1100 (EDT) Subject: Re: [os2genau] Dual-Boot eCS & Win98 or W2k On Thu, 24 May 2001 20:43:12 +1000, Ed Durrant wrote: >I believe I read that the same procedure of installing Pinball.dll >and modifying the registry works under the NT4 based W2K as >it does in NT4 but I haven't actually tried it myself, not feeling >the urge to (IMO) waste money on Windows 2000. Unfortunately, I had to (it was that or NT) so that I could do some work at home and on the bus. I'll dig out the files and try it. -- David Forrester davidforatterrigal dot net dot au http://www.os2world dot com/djfos2/ 16================================================ Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 22:05:33 +0830 From: Leigh Bunting Subject: [os2genau] MS - both of them The residents of Silicon Valley are more confused than usual after a billboard campaign by the National Multiple Sclerosis Society of America used this line in an ad slogan. "MS: It's not a software company." Exploiting the fame of a certain company to draw attention to an altogether worthier cause. Requests to comment on the campaign have been met by a surly silence by Microsoft which doesn't relish the association of ideas, but is painfully aware that it can't afford to appear insensitive over such an issue. Seasoned IT professionals will have no trouble telling the two MS's apart: One is a debilitating and surprisingly widespread affliction that renders the sufferer barely able to perform the simplest task. The other is a disease. -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Find out more about Col. Light Gdns. here - http://www.chariot dot net dot au/~pknight/clghs/ 17================================================ From: "Ian Manners" Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 23:02:34 +1000 (EST) Subject: Re: [os2genau] MS - both of them Hi Leigh >Seasoned IT professionals will have no trouble telling the two MS's >apart: >One is a debilitating and surprisingly widespread affliction that >renders the sufferer barely able to perform the simplest task. >The other is a disease. Nothing like a good laugh, my wife loved this, she has MS, and also hates MicroSoft, being the Mac fiend in the family. Cheers Ian B Manners END================================================