From: Digest To: "OS/2GenAu Digest" Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2008 00:01:21 EST-10EDT,10,-1,0,7200,3,-1,0,7200,3600 Subject: [os2genau_digest] No. 1632 Reply-To: X-List-Unsubscribe: www.os2site.com/list/ ************************************************** Friday 28 March 2008 Number 1632 ************************************************** Subjects for today 1 Re: Spam : madodel 2 Re: Spam : Voytek Eymont" 3 Re: Spam : Voytek Eymont" 4 Re: Spam : John Angelico" 5 Re: Spam : Voytek Eymont" 6 Re: Spam : Simon Lewis 7 Re: Spam : Ed Durrant 8 Re: Spam : Peter Moylan 9 Re: Spam : John Angelico" 10 Re: Spam : Voytek Eymont" 11 Re: Spam : Ed Durrant **= Email 1 ==========================** Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 15:01:53 -0500 From: madodel Subject: Re: Spam Peter Moylan wrote: > On 27/03/08 23:08, Voytek Eymont wrote: >> >> >>> Peter, >>> do any OS/2 mail clients support IMAP/TLS ? POP/TLS ? SMTP/AUTH ? >> >> I guess Thunderbird does, but I don't think PMMail does > > That's the answer I was going to give, but I must admit that it's a > couple of years since I looked at any OS/2 mail client other than > Thunderbird. At a certain point - after waiting almost forever for > PMMail to get updated character set support - I decided that Thunderbird > was the only client that had a chance of being upgraded to meet changing > practices and standards. MR/2 ICE was still being supported at that > stage, but it was a bit klunky even by comparison with a non-supported > PMMail. > > It's possible that PMMail might move ahead in the race, since it's > supported again. The reason why Thunderbird updates keep coming is that > Innotek made it easy to port Windows versions of Mozilla software to > OS/2. What happens when Thunderbird starts using Windows features that > Innotek doesn't support, given that (as far as I know) Innotek is no > longer updating their stuff? This makes me nervous, given that Windows > has always been a moving target. > MR2ICE does support SMTP/Authentication as well. And its still being developed, just not by Nick Knight any more. Mark -- From the eComStation Desktop of: Mark Dodel Warpstock 2007 - Toronto, Ontario, Canada: http://www.warpstock dot org Warpstock Europe - Valkenswaard close to Eindhoven, the Netherlands: http://www.warpstock.eu For a choice in the future of personal computing, Join VOICE - http://www.os2voice dot org "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." Franklin Delano Roosevelt, Message proposing the Monopoly Investigation, 1938 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 2 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 06:35:13 +1100 (EST) From: "Voytek Eymont" Subject: Re: Spam > That's the answer I was going to give, but I must admit that it's a > couple of years since I looked at any OS/2 mail client other than > Thunderbird. At a certain point - after waiting almost forever for > PMMail to get updated character set support - I decided that Thunderbird > was the only client that had a chance of being upgraded to meet changing > practices and standards. MR/2 ICE was still being supported at that stage, > but it was a bit klunky even by comparison with a non-supported PMMail. thanks, Peter I was looking at something that I can use with PMfax, as transport for faxes, but with smtp/auth support, I've been using PRM for that it might be easier for me to install a local mail server... -- Voytek ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 3 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 06:36:34 +1100 (EST) From: "Voytek Eymont" Subject: Re: Spam > Peter Moylan wrote: > >> On 27/03/08 23:08, Voytek Eymont wrote: > MR2ICE does support SMTP/Authentication as well. And its still being > developed, just not by Nick Knight any more. Mark, thanks, I'll try that, I think MR2ICE is supported by PMfax -- Voytek ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 4 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 08:09:45 +1000 (AEST) From: "John Angelico" Subject: Re: Spam On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 23:08:54 +1100 (EST), Voytek Eymont wrote: > > > >> Peter, >> do any OS/2 mail clients support IMAP/TLS ? POP/TLS ? SMTP/AUTH ? > >I guess Thunderbird does, but I don't think PMMail does > > That's "yet", Voytek. For PMMail, there is SMTP Auth as I posted from the help file, but IMAP is still to come. However, it IS on the agenda. I don't need (:-) ) the TLS security but if you go to the VOICE site and ask a question the gurus of the PMMail dev team will be able to tell you more (and prob more than you want to know). Best regards John Angelico OS/2 Zealot Melbourne Victoria, AUSTRALIA Email: talldad at kepl dot com dot au ------------------------------------------------ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 5 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 08:26:46 +1100 (EST) From: "Voytek Eymont" Subject: Re: Spam > On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 23:08:54 +1100 (EST), Voytek Eymont wrote: >> >>> do any OS/2 mail clients support IMAP/TLS ? POP/TLS ? SMTP/AUTH ? >> I guess Thunderbird does, but I don't think PMMail does > That's "yet", Voytek. > > > For PMMail, there is SMTP Auth as I posted from the help file, but IMAP > is still to come. > > However, it IS on the agenda. > > > I don't need (:-) ) the TLS security but if you go to the VOICE site and > ask a question the gurus of the PMMail dev team will be able to tell you > more (and prob more than you want to know). John, thanks yes, I've read the file you've posted, downloaded the archive I'm really not sure what I've seen it does what I wanted it to do (SMTP AUTH); secondly, the build I've installed didn't seem that ready for prime time.... and, just to explain, I'm NOT looking for a mail client to use as a mail client, I want something to use with PMfax's email fax feature; that will support smtp auth so I can relay via may (remote) mail server, or, relay via my isp's mail server I use PRM for that, problem is, no smtp auth it might prove easier to install a local mail server -- Voytek ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 6 ==========================** Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 18:58:33 -0700 From: Simon Lewis Subject: Re: Spam Thank you. SBC "technical support" is a true oxymoron, and their fee based "Support Plus" more so. Apparently lots of customers are having email problems, their only solution to push people into SSL and onto SBC Yahoo mail.Everything else is "unsupported." Simon Voytek Eymont wrote: > > > >>On 27/03/08 02:24, Simon Lewis wrote: >> >> > > > >>You might have the ports set incorrectly. Without SSL, the standard mail >>ports are 110 for POP3 and 25 for SMTP. With SSL, you should use port 995 >>for POP and port 465 for SMTP. Some mail clients will change the port >>numbers automatically as soon as you specify the use of TLS. (Or SSL, for >>older mail clients.) Others don't, so it would be a good idea to check. >> >> > >and IMAP on 143 and IMAP/TLS 993; >and, SMTP can also be on 587 (which is what I use (but no longer recall >why I chose 587 over 465)) > >services:submission 587/tcp msa # mail message >submission >services:submission 587/udp msa # mail message >submission >services:smtps 465/tcp # SMTP over SSL (TLS) > >Peter, >do any OS/2 mail clients support IMAP/TLS ? POP/TLS ? SMTP/AUTH ? > > > > [attachments have been removed] ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 7 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:34:18 +1100 From: Ed Durrant Subject: Re: Spam I had lots of problems with BigPond's SPAM system holding up valid mail for 6 hours - so much so that I switched to Google Mail. No more problems (Google mail dioes require a logon using SSL however - Thunderbird has this capability). Cheers/2 Ed. Simon Lewis wrote: > Thank you. SBC "technical support" is a true oxymoron, and their fee > based "Support Plus" more so. Apparently lots of customers are having > email problems, their only solution to push people into SSL and onto > SBC Yahoo mail.Everything else is "unsupported." > > Simon > > Voytek Eymont wrote: > >> >> >> >>> On 27/03/08 02:24, Simon Lewis wrote: >>> >> >> >> >>> You might have the ports set incorrectly. Without SSL, the standard >>> mail >>> ports are 110 for POP3 and 25 for SMTP. With SSL, you should use >>> port 995 >>> for POP and port 465 for SMTP. Some mail clients will change the port >>> numbers automatically as soon as you specify the use of TLS. (Or >>> SSL, for >>> older mail clients.) Others don't, so it would be a good idea to check. >>> >> >> and IMAP on 143 and IMAP/TLS 993; >> and, SMTP can also be on 587 (which is what I use (but no longer recall >> why I chose 587 over 465)) >> >> services:submission 587/tcp msa # mail message >> submission >> services:submission 587/udp msa # mail message >> submission >> services:smtps 465/tcp # SMTP over SSL (TLS) >> >> Peter, >> do any OS/2 mail clients support IMAP/TLS ? POP/TLS ? SMTP/AUTH ? >> >> >> >> > > > [attachments have been removed] > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 8 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 15:33:15 +1100 From: Peter Moylan Subject: Re: Spam Ed Durrant wrote: > I had lots of problems with BigPond's SPAM system holding up valid > mail for 6 hours - so much so that I switched to Google Mail. No more > problems (Google mail dioes require a logon using SSL however - > Thunderbird has this capability). > Just a minor correction to the terminology. There are two options you can choose for the incoming server, and the same two options again for the outgoing server: 1. "Secure authentication" in Thunderbird encrypts the login, i.e. the username and password. It does this by using the AUTH command, which is a standard command in IMAP and an optional extension - an option that is implemented by most mail software these days - in POP3 and SMTP. 2. "Secure connection" encrypts the actual mail message during transmission, so that anyone listening in can't read the mail. Here, you can choose TLS (the current standard) or SSL (for older mail servers). Sensible ISPs ask for option 1 (authentication) as an anti-spammer measure. They shouldn't be asking for option 2 (TLS or SSL). That should be your own personal decision, because it has nothing to do with needing to supply a password. -- Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan dot org peter at pmoylan dot org ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 9 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 19:20:34 +1000 (AEST) From: "John Angelico" Subject: Re: Spam On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 08:26:46 +1100 (EST), Voytek Eymont wrote: >and, just to explain, I'm NOT looking for a mail client to use as a mail >client, I want something to use with PMfax's email fax feature; >that will support smtp auth so I can relay via may (remote) mail server, >or, relay via my isp's mail server Fair enough. I never found that much use for the feature myself, because here it looks like a solution looking for a problem we don't have. >I use PRM for that, problem is, no smtp auth >it might prove easier to install a local mail server > I suggest that you keep talking to Peter M about Weasel then. Best regards John Angelico OS/2 SIG os2 at melbpc dot org dot au or talldad at kepl dot com dot au ___________________ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 10 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 19:43:51 +1100 (EST) From: "Voytek Eymont" Subject: Re: Spam > On Fri, 28 Mar 2008 08:26:46 +1100 (EST), Voytek Eymont wrote: > Fair enough. I never found that much use for the feature myself, because > here it looks like a solution looking for a problem we don't have. I sometimes get stuff, brochures, quotes in the mail or by fax, generally several pages, that I need to distribute to a number of ppl with PMfax/PRM, it's a cinch, if it's fax, just (re) efax to a distribution list; if it's a letter/brochure/whatever, just whack it on the ADF, click on CopyShop, presto, done i find it a terrific tool for distributing bits of paper to ppl -- Voytek ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- **= Email 11 ==========================** Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 19:04:22 +1100 From: Ed Durrant Subject: Re: Spam Peter Moylan wrote: > Ed Durrant wrote: >> I had lots of problems with BigPond's SPAM system holding up valid >> mail for 6 hours - so much so that I switched to Google Mail. No more >> problems (Google mail dioes require a logon using SSL however - >> Thunderbird has this capability). >> > Just a minor correction to the terminology. There are two options you > can choose for the incoming server, and the same two options again for > the outgoing server: > > 1. "Secure authentication" in Thunderbird encrypts the login, i.e. the > username and password. It does this by using the AUTH command, which is > a standard command in IMAP and an optional extension - an option that is > implemented by most mail software these days - in POP3 and SMTP. > > 2. "Secure connection" encrypts the actual mail message during > transmission, so that anyone listening in can't read the mail. Here, you > can choose TLS (the current standard) or SSL (for older mail servers). > > Sensible ISPs ask for option 1 (authentication) as an anti-spammer > measure. They shouldn't be asking for option 2 (TLS or SSL). That should > be your own personal decision, because it has nothing to do with needing > to supply a password. > Google mail requires SSL on port 995. Cheers/2 Ed. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------